Standing BB Overhead Press - spine compression?

[md3sign]

Alright, so I started doing standing BB overhead presses again (ala Rippetoe) and realized how much I miss them. Anyway, I do have to lean back a bit and tilt my head back to clear the bar, which is fine, but I notice that my spine "compresses" with all that weight. It's been like that for as long as I can remember any time I do a heavy set. Obviously it's not a problem when you do them seated, but I prefer the standing method with knees locked out.

Am I just b!tching for nothing or are you not supposed to feel any kind of lower back compression?

[aCb123]

try lowering the weight a little and keep the bar as close to your face as possible. also move your head and body under the bar when you pass your nose.

[md3sign]

Yea I do that; I've scraped my nose/chin more than a handful of times as a result of being too close.

As for lowering the weight, if I can do 5+ reps and feel the compression, why would I lower it?

[aCb123]

are your elbows pointing foward? also make sure your keepin your core tight.

[chaddukes]

Perhaps you're not bracing your core sufficiently? Try squeezing the hell out of your glutes and abs. And try not to lean back! Then see how you feel. You'll need to lower the weight a bit.

[md3sign]

Originally Posted by aCb123

are your elbows pointing foward? also make sure your keepin your core tight.

My core definitely feels tight. No my elbows aren't forward, they're at my sides, they point out.

I'll see how it goes the next couple weeks I guess. Maybe my form just needs some work or I need to adjust to it since I haven't done them in over a year.

[aCb123]

try using a more narrow grip on the bar ( i use the same grip i use for bent over rows/deads). also breathe in on the way up and out on the way down.

[Jack_Lupino]

I was recently told at a workshop that based on some study vertical compression on the spine causes no damage...

lateral on the other hand...

[md3sign]

interesting, source? bump

[mobikwa]

Do you have any problems when you do squats or deadlifts? I would think your spine would get more compressed on those lifts when the weight is heavier than your press weight.

[md3sign]

No, no problem on squats or deadlifts. Overhead press is a little different because you have to lean back to clear the bar, which I think is where the extra compression happens.

[chaddukes]

Originally Posted by md3sign

No, no problem on squats or deadlifts. Overhead press is a little different because you have to lean back to clear the bar, which I think is where the extra compression happens.

I think that you have a misconception about how much you should be leaning back. You don't really need to lean back to clear your head. You need to move the bar around your head. Overhead Pressing is one of the easiest lifts to cheat on. You can easily take a little extra drive from your legs, lean back too far, etc. in order to lift a bigger weight. That's why it fell out of favor in olympic weight lifting. You shouldn't really be leaning back at all. This is why you're back is feeling compressed.

If it is truly a weakness in the core, then doing barbell rollouts will correct that weakness.

[BigRick87]

Try softening the compression on the negative portion by unlocking your knees when you are in the eccentric phase and easing the weight down. I never recomend having your knees locked on any exercise, finishing a rep into lock-out position is one thing, but keeping a load on you body with locked knees can be trouble after a period of time, and it also leades to not as much cushioning.

[GuyJin]

Aside from the stance and elbows-out issue--and I'm sure you're paying attention to how you do it, OP--you have to realize that a bit of compression will occur; it's only natural as in everyday life our spines are simply not used to lifting heavy stuff overhead as many of our ancestors did. (And I'm not even sure they did that all that often).

What is NOT good is the layback. Many guys have made that mistake and over time, it will cause damage if the weight is too heavy and it's done too often. So, FWIW, I'd lighten up first on the weight you push overhead, make sure your stance and form are perfect, keep your lower back strong )hypers, deads, good mornings) and after your session, do a lot of just hanging from a bar; more than anything else, it'll stretch you out.

(Oh, and 299 of them died. Just setting the record straight...)

[md3sign]

Hmm, good points, I'll have to think it over. I need to double check my form. I prefer the locked knee position so I know I'm not cheating, but I see how leaning back is cheating as well. Back to the drawing board for me.

Here's the other thing: I do feel like a badass pressing big wheels overhead, but is it really optimal? I mean, are the downsides (compression, leaning back, locked knees) outweighed by some sort of extra benefit vs. seated BB/DB presses?

Lol 298 actually, my roomie dressed up as a Spartan as well, I just cropped him out.

[peteskeys]

Originally Posted by md3sign

Hmm, good points, I'll have to think it over. I need to double check my form. I prefer the locked knee position so I know I'm not cheating, but I see how leaning back is cheating as well. Back to the drawing board for me.

Here's the other thing: I do feel like a badass pressing big wheels overhead, but is it really optimal? I mean, are the downsides (compression, leaning back, locked knees) outweighed by some sort of extra benefit vs. seated BB/DB presses?

Lol 298 actually, my roomie dressed up as a Spartan as well, I just cropped him out.

Seems to me that, like most lifts, the overhead press is about as safe as you make it. If you work within your limits and don't let your ego get the best of you, the overhead press is a great movement. It's when you start to do things like lean back too far that spinal compression can become a serious issue and you risk doing serious damage to yourself. If you're in doubt about your form, you could check out the youtube playlist Rippetoe has on pressing correctly (http://www.youtube.com/view_play_lis...press+rippetoe). Personally I find that I can't reset and start from a dead stop as the weight gets heavy, but I manage to not lean back and not bounce with my legs, so as far as I know it's still legit.

As for the benefits over something like a seated press, the main benefits are those you probably already know about. The standing overhead press builds full body strength, power, and coordination--in addition to making you a badass. It taxes your core and back as well as working the shoulders.

[GuyJin]

You really have to find out which will serve you best. If you're into O lifting then obviously the standing version is best, no argument. And no argument that the "bad-ass feeling" is there as well; I feel the same way. But in my case, I also have a crapped-out lower back (mainly genetic) with very little cartilage between the discs--they actually grate on each other from time to time and THAT is one lousy feeling I wouldn't wish on anyone--so I've gone to the seated version. Yes, less weight, but also stricter and no lower back pain. There are trade-offs for everything.

FWIW, I'd lower the weight a bit and use perfect form (if it isn't that way already). If you find that it just ain't there, then go to the seated version, use dumbells, or machines if necessary. Muscles know weight; they don't care if it's a Hammer press or an Ivanko barbell. My two yen...

[Metal_Lust]

I remember feeling much lower back pressure doing barbell presses. My elbows were pointing forward, tight core, I didn't feel like I was leaning back very much at all but it was still hurting a little bit. I stuck my butt out a little and it felt perfect so just throwing that out there if you need another idea.

[md3sign]

Thanks for the video, good reminder. Now that I see it I think my form is off; I'll have to check it next time I do them; definitely don't want to do it wrong.